Saturday, November 20, 2010

An Open Letter To Supervisor Frank Spencer

Spencer Letter

18 comments:

  1. I'm a 157 member and this is worth concentrating a great deal on.

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  2. Thank you John. I attended the meeting and was going to second the motion until Lawrence started to smack people down. I did not really understand what was going on and thought he made members look foolish. Why didn't he explain the procedure like you just did before asking members to second the motion. keep up the fight.

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  3. For Lawrence to act to act the way he did in front of Dennis Walsh. He must have a deal with the devil Because if Walsh doesn't take him out now. The fix is in.

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  4. John,
    "
    First the motion was a NEW motion.The only way to change the wording by adding or deleting is to amend the motion. You cannot amend the motion unless it passed and accepted.This motion was defeated.
    When El Arence refused your motion as new you should have appealed his decision and forced a vote.He was absolutely wrong when he advised you to make a motion to reconsider since you could not so so.

    It is also obvious his actions were premeditated and somebody advised him in anticipation of your motion to reconsider.To bad you did not cal for a point of order so his ruling would be included in the minutes and then appealed his decision.Under the Point of Order he would have also had to explain out of his own mouth using Roberts rules why your motion was not a new one.Exactly how versed was he in the rules or was he repeating what he was told to say.

    You are spot on with his violations but lets not forget Section 33. Duties of President of Local Union

    "The President shall enforce the Constitution and bylaws of the United Brotherhood"

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  5. All these tough union reps arent so tough after all.They are no longer effective because they are no longer respected.They lost touch with the rank and file a long time ago due to showing more loyalty to the contracters than the membership.DROP DEAD UNITY TEAM.They forever have to be looking over their shoulder's on a dark street.ROT IN HELL UNITY TEAM.

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  6. How come no one brings up the connection of Vinny "The Chin" Gigante's to Lawrence D'Errico?
    The MOB has been involved in the union for decades & they are still involved.INVESTIGATE these "alleged" ties to organized crime & DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

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  7. Richard, I suspected trickery when D'Errico refused my new motion.

    You are correct, I should have appealed his decision, I was caught off guard and allowed myself to be led into making the motion to reconsider.

    I foolishly believed I was dealing with someone with good intentions...I will not make the same mistake again.

    It would have been interesting hearing him explain why the motion was not new.

    Lawrence will have that opportunity to explain at trail why the motion was not a new one.

    Maybe we are all wrong and he will enlighten us with his wisdom!

    Once again, we are all benefiting, and learning a lesson on Roberts Rules.

    Thanks for all your help.

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  8. john , stay right on top of lawrence . understand that he is told what to say & what not to say or do ! he always thought he was somebody , but he is really a nobody ! the fed's aren't done yet by no means . keep up doing what you do , your blog is great

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  9. John, Richard is correct, this is from Wikipedia.

    Renewal (parliamentary procedure)

    Renewal is the act of bringing up again a motion that has already been disposed of by the deliberative assembly.

    Generally, the assembly cannot be asked to decide the same, or substantially the same, question as one it has already decided in the same session.

    Renewal of motions is closely tied to the parliamentary concept of session.

    Sessions in ordinary societies usually consist of one meeting, but legislative sessions can continue for months or years. A motion that has been rejected (voted down) in one session, cannot be easily brought up again in that session, but can be renewed in following sessions as a new motion.

    Motions such as Reconsider are typically used to renew or revisit a motion within the same session.

    Motions such as Rescind or Amend something previously adopted are generally applied to motions adopted in a previous session.

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  10. John, I also found this.

    http://www.parlipro.org/faqanswers.htm

    If a motion has been defeated, can it be brought up again at the next meeting?

    Yes, if the meeting is a different session, which is the normal situation, in other than legislative bodies. For more information, refer to RONR 10th ed. pp. 325-331.

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  11. I want to thank Richard and the others who posted comments regarding President D'Errico's ruling on the motion.

    I researched all the comments and they are 100 percent accurate.

    This further demonstrates President/Director of Operation, Lawrence D'Errico's, lack of knowledge, trickery and zeal used in a premeditated plan to violate the rights of the members.

    I emailed the following comments to Supervisor Frank Spencer, Cc to all.

    Richard Dorrough said... John, "First the motion was a NEW motion. The only way to change the wording by adding or deleting is to amend the motion. You cannot amend the motion unless it passed and accepted. This motion was defeated. When El Arence refused your motion as new you should have appealed his decision and forced a vote. He was absolutely wrong when he advised you to make a motion to reconsider since you could not do so."

    Anonymous said... John, Richard is correct, this is from Wikipedia. Renewal (parliamentary procedure) Renewal is the act of bringing up again a motion that has already been disposed of by the deliberative assembly. Generally, the assembly cannot be asked to decide the same, or substantially the same, question as one it has already decided in the same session. Renewal of motions is closely tied to the parliamentary concept of session. Sessions in ordinary societies usually consist of one meeting, but legislative sessions can continue for months or years. A motion that has been rejected (voted down) in one session, cannot be easily brought up again in that session, but can be renewed in following sessions as a new motion.

    Anonymous said... John, I also found this. http://www.parlipro.org/faqanswers.htm Q. If a motion has been defeated, can it be brought up again at the next meeting?
    Yes, if the meeting is a different session, which is the normal situation, in other than legislative bodies.

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  12. “If a motion has been defeated, can it be brought up again at the next meeting?”

    This has been a question that has come up a number of times. Many members feel that if you decide on something at a meeting you can’t bring it up again at another meeting. But the real answer is - YES, you can. If the meeting is a different session, which is the normal situation, (in other than legislative bodies), you can definitely bring up a defeated motion at the next meeting. For example we have had motions that have been defeated at our national convention and provincial conferences and have been brought up again at subsequent meetings. There is nothing wrong with that. Just because at one meeting the members in attendance did not approve of the motion doesn’t mean it can never come up again.

    Circumstances may change, finances may improve or decrease or the members in attendance at a future meeting may have a different opinion. A decision of members at one meeting cannot bind the decision of the members at a future meeting or else there would be no point in holding future meetings!

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  13. The ParliamentarianNovember 22, 2010 at 6:13 AM

    Question: If a motion has been defeated, can it be brought up again at the next meeting?

    Answer: You have been hoodwinked!!! Something that is defeated can be brought up again and again.

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  14. RENEWAL OF MOTIONS: At the next meeting you may make the same motion that was defeated regardless of how you voted on he original motion.

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  15. Lawrence D’Errico is an advertisement for the need for term limits. Time in office helps accrue power, and absolute power corrupts.

    When you do not accept concrete evidence of your guilt, you blindly perceive yourself to be too powerful for something as blase as justice.

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  16. Not only is D'Errico violating the rights of members, he is doing it in such a smug and arrogant way that he demonstrates his contempt for the members he is suppose to serve and protect.

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  17. john , do you really think spencer is going to answer your letter ? he does what cash mc morron tells him ! even humpy dumpy had a great fall . remember , everything comes to he who waits

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  18. I spoke with the Inspector General yesterday and he is reviewing the meeting minutes.

    I also sent him this emai:

    Scott, As per our telephone conversation today, this will help you in your review.

    From www.parlipro.org which is dedicated to advancing the knowledge of parliamentary procedure.

    Frequently Asked Questions
    21. If a motion has been defeated, can it be brought up again at the next meeting?

    Yes, if the meeting is a different session, which is the normal situation, in other than legislative bodies. For more information, refer to RONR 10th ed. pp. 325-331.

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